Jesus teaches love and compassion. Christianity teaches the Ten Commandments. So what is so frightening about the Christian religion that makes people attack those who believe? Is it the pagan level of society today? Is it lack of education in God's doctrine? Is it the immoral factions pressing for equality? What do you think is the problem in today's society?
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Agreed. No point in me answering. This said it perfectly!
Many Christians believe that it is their obligation to save your soul by converting you. That is just reality. There is scripture to support that. The problem really is that it is not every Christian's job. And most are ill trained.
If you have no problems with Jesus Christ, perhaps you should seek Him and ignore the followers who have failed. There will always be hypocrites in any religion. You find them everywhere in and out of religion. The followers are irrelevant.
I respect that, but I don't understand it Eric. I feel no need to convert people to agnosticism or atheism and I respect the rights of others to believe what they will. "Saving" people to me seems ego driven - a need to be better than others.
To be fair, Christin, not all Christians seek to convert others. Some Christians hold their beliefs as more of a personal philosophy that applies only to them rather then the mob mentality thinking that others hold to
I do believe that many "new" Christians take an ego driven path. "Look,, I brought in ten souls to your one". And "fund raising" is another such issue. I made my youth group take a full year of training before any outreach.
I know that Deepes - I have many Christian friends that I adore that walk the talk so to speak :) I'm not saying "all" Christians do that. I don't believe "all" in any group to be bad/good etc. we're all human.
I think a nail just got hit on it's head :)
Obviously you do not venture into the land of loveliness where God resides. Otherwise, you would assist those who do not practice love and morals to understand they should change. This is probably why you feel they impose their beliefs on others.
Whatever you say TA I have a perfectly beautiful life that I love very much and I don't need your dogma or anyone else's to have it.
ChristinS, I think you have a beautiful life and a great soul and what we call a "walking with beauty" attitude. I am sorry if someone suggests otherwise. My Christ loves you as do I.
@TA, I have had those moments you speak of. You don't need Jesus's intervention to do so. Mine were direct . . . and awesome.
1 Thessalonians 3:2
We sent Timothy, who is our brother and co-worker in God’s service in spreading the gospel of Christ, to strengthen and encourage you in your faith,
I am so happy to hear that you are a perfectly loving and moral person. Who told you this if you have no belief in a deity? We have to base our beliefs and feeling on something. In Christianity, we are all sinners, saved by Grace.
@JOENOLT seriously? my actions are what determine how good and moral I am, the same as with anyone else and no religion or diety is required for that.
Yes Christin, I am serious. You say that your actions are what determine how good and moral you are. What are your actions based on? Who decided that your action was right? Are you Playing God?
There are many loving and caring people on this earth.
Most do not fear the Christian faith.
2 Timothy 1:14 Guard the good deposit that was entrusted to you—guard it with the help of the Holy Spirit who lives in us.
One day you will understand completely...in not too long is my guess.
Deepes Mind makes a really cool point: Not all Christians are called to convert. All Christians are expected to openly share our faith in, and our love for, Jesus. Few adults EVER acquiesce to confrontation and someone in their face in ANY regard.
Gabriel, True that! My son Gabriel gets it at 3. That love part is what I know of as God. That religion part is ho hum, boring. We love what is good. We try to shun what is bad. I believe in you. Please believe in yourself.
The fear of the Lord is the beginning of wisdom; all who follow his precepts have good understanding. To him belongs eternal praise.
I have belief in myself and am happy with my life. I am a very contented person.
taburkett, I wasn't actually talking about God being the power behind religion, I was talking about people.
Mr Gabriel, I like your anwser. You are rigt.
Aptly stated, Gabriel!
I understand your disgust with what happened in the Catholic Church. However, there is a very real experience with God that does not require you to be part of organized religion. Jesus Christ is the only way to salvation. Seek and you will find.
Why would a "God" forsake billions of people? Very large problem #2 with Christianity for me. I don't buy that only a few are chosen. If God created everything, he created those other religions also. Why? To trick people into "hell"? makes no sense.
Jesus is the sun...there, mystery solved. He travels around with his 12 zodiac disciples and performs healing miracles, because he reaches everyone, because he is the SUN!! Now, can humanity resume "getting along like decent people?"
God did not forsake people; He died to save them. Mankind is responsible to believe the gospel. It is not God's fault if they do not. The Lord did not "create those other religions also"; He said, "You shall have no other gods before Me."
glynch1 God is the creator of everything though? so how did "he" not "create" those religions? If he didn't then I think he didn't create your religion either. In fact, I think man created all of it.
Have you ever heard of Satan? He is the father of lies; he is the originator of all false religions. Ever read about "doctrines of demons"? No. God did not create Buddhism, Islam, and false Christianity; fallen men listened to the own evil hearts.
glynch1, Yes I've also heard of the bogeyman and I don't believe in him either. Hellfire and the Devil are used to control people and frighten them. I grew up with this nonsense pushed on me, then I started thinking for myself.
Your not believing that hell and Satan exist does not make it so. I believe Jesus.
Glynch1, if God created everything but not religions. He still would have created the Devil who did create religions. So... It's God's doing either way.
and your believing in it doesn't make it true. Believe whatever you want, but who are you to judge anyone else glynch? This is why people run screaming away from religion - and rightly so.
God created Lucifer, but Lucifer rebelled against His authority. God did not force Lucifer to sin against Him; he sinned of his own free will. Christin, I am not judging you; your own words judge you. People run because they hate God and love sin.
Jesus is the SUN! The devil is things not real, and the light of the sun illuminates that which IS in the HERE and NOW. He's the one LIGHT we have from the CREATIVE FORCE we cannot see, and the "demons" are only what keep us from knowing that.
Running away from a problem never fixes it - it only temporarily avoids it until you experience it again. When a problem exists, moral loving adults fix it before it gets worse.
Order came before religion, Glynch. I believe religion spawned to scare the people in olden days when they were gullible. Now education has advanced. Fewer followers. Religion scares people from committing crime. A great tool, but no longer effective
Proverbs 1 7 The fear of the Lord is the beginning of knowledge, but fools despise wisdom and instruction.20Out in the open wisdom calls aloud, she raises her voice in the public square;21 on top of the wall she cries out,
Humans are the originator of all religions. Glynch1, you are the sort of fundamentalist preacher that drives sensible people away from the church. They are lucky to have heard you and siezed the opportunity to escape.
God didn't die to save people. It was Christ that died to save people from their sin. According to John 3:16, God sent his son, not himself, that whoever believe shall not perish but have everlasting life
Is not Christ God, the Second Person of the Trinity? Therefore, the incarnate God die die. To be sure, God (the Father) did not die for sinful humanity.
OHHH.. You believe in the trinity of a 3 in one God. So you believe that God (as Christ) Sacrificed himself TO himself in an effort to save mankind? Sorry, but Christ never claimed to be God or a God. He always directed people to God.
That is not the deal. God does not need to sacrifice His Son for us. How silly. But He did. How strange? It had to be to teach us something. I have ideas. But the point is that the Trinity is 3 in one. How many do you have inside you?
Mental, emotional, physical - 3 in one. Altogether now - in the name of the father (point to your mental head), and of the son (point to your emotional heart) and the holy spirit (cross your physical body). Truth hidden in plain sight. Thanks church.
1 John 4:18
There is no fear in love. But perfect love drives out fear, because fear has to do with punishment. The one who fears is not made perfect in love.
Yep. "Don't worry, don't be afraid, it's just a ride. And we can change it any time we want - it's only a choice between fear and love." - Bill Hicks
2Timothy2: 15 Do your best to present yourself to God as one approved, a worker who does not need to be ashamed and who correctly handles the word of truth.
Lol...a conglomeration of like-minded opinions does not make any one thing more "right", but I guess if you understood that you'd be out of writing material, eh GM? And TA, yeah, I get that. That's a matter of one's character, not religion.
1 Timothy 4:1 The Spirit clearly says that in later times some will abandon the faith and follow deceiving spirits and things taught by demons.
Galatians 5:5 For through the Spirit we eagerly await by faith the righteousness for which we hope.
I don't follow any teachings, just my direct connect to all that is. And I don't await anything - I create for the creator by grabbing his lessons by the balls. You're wasting your life not learning all there is to learn now. That's the lesson.
Truth here. If I teach and someone follows my teaching I am a buffoon. If I listen and blindly follow I am an idiot. I teach and I preach. My Goodness I hope no one follows. I can only open minds to learn for themselves -- I am glad in that.
time has little meaning for those who follow the devil
evil is growing as leaders divide us into welfare slavery
no matter how hard we reach to properly teach
immoral attacks each denying and driving them to evil
moral must stand for better society
WHO HERE IS FOLLOWING THE "DEVIL"!? You're juvenile thinking that some side with "God", and some side with "Satan", and that's how we tell each other apart. We are all innocent , start with that. I care less what our leaders do - they don't guide me
Excellent synopsis, could not have said it better. As people become more educated, they will question organized religion. They see NO NEED TO prescribe to atavistic religious concepts. They see through the religious progam.
GM thanks for your comments lately. I went to a Catholic wedding this weekend. It's funny, I never remember the priest pleading for respect for the house of God when I was Catholic, but a white girl with dreads I hear it every time I'm in one now...
education is good when it leads to moral principles and solid ethics.
society is then advanced. however, much of education today is based on immoral acceptance. this leads to destruction of moral society. this is clearly wicked reversion.
Lee Tea, I agree that God is all around us. I also agree that Christianity is not dependent on any religion. The book of Romans was written to keep us away from religion. Paul didn't leave one religion to go to another. Paul followed Christ.
Good point Js. That's the problem a lot of people confuse Christianity with an organized religion.
Catholicism is not true Christianity. Never has been, probably never will be. Charlatans who preach the "prosperity gospel" are teaching heresy. People fear what they think is Christianity but is in reality another religion devoid of truth.
1 Timothy 4:6 If you point these things out to the brothers and sisters,[a] you will be a good minister of Christ Jesus, nourished on the truths of the faith and of the good teaching that you have followed.
I appreciate your citing Scripture, but adding an explanation would help me understand your point.
“Blessed are you when people insult you, persecute you and falsely say all kinds of evil against you because of me.
Wish we could leave longer comments. Then maybe he would explain But Matt 5:11 sounds a lot like my life
Chef, well thought out answer - you covered the main points but as you can see, you might as well be talking to a wall for the responses you get!
Immoral factions attack the moral standards emphasized in the Bible. Many attempt to sway the moral individual by declaring a false attitude of morality. This is viewed as a harrowed attitude for immoral practice attempting to distribute immoral acts
What's immoral is opinion. Don't you see? You think you serve "God", and I think I do "good" and everyone's on the same side of the coin. Just because I don't agree with you doesn't mean I hail "satan"... though we differ on what that even is.
*the spread of complete lies
*child abuse (trying to indoctrinate them into a religion by saying obey or burn)
*changing the bible to suit new laws
The problem with most that argue against the Bible have never taken the time to read it. Searching for points is easy with the internet. Picking and choosing isn't what the Bible is about. God is explained in His Word.
The way of the wicked is strewn with promotion of immoral.
The path of the righteous beams a moral light for the path to glory.
"Catholicism is not true Christianity. Never has been, probably never will be. " You know glynch1, Catholics say Christians aren't true Catholics. You both are very sure yours is the most right way, and the other groups of your subset are a bit off.
Christianity has 41 THOUSAND factions! Most, if not all, claim to be the True One, denouncing others, to the point of focusing on specific ones. That alone would scare me!
P.S. I was in a Christian cult.
True Christians are not and do not want to be Roman Catholics. Why would they want to turn from following the truth of the Scriptures to going after an apostate, pseudo-Christian belief system?
So, the bad points are those who disagree with your lifestyle. Wow. Isn't that convenient.
JThomp42, isn't misrepresentation (which you just did to aliasis' answer) a form of bearing false witness (Exodus 20:16)?
I did not misinterpret her answer at all. That is simply ridiculous quoting 1 verse of scripture from a whole chapter JimMiles.
JThomp42, u r a Christian; didn't think u'd need more than 1. "...all liars, their portion will be in the lake that burns with fire and sulfur, which is the second death," Revelation 21:8. Proverbs 19:9, "A false witness will not go unpunished."
I am not a false witness. Where did you get that non-sense? I fully understand this answer and I commented appropriately. I am a child of God saved by the blood of Jesus Christ. I do not have to worry about the lake of fire. r u a Christian??
JThomp, u think paraphrasing "gay persecution" and "telling people they're going to hell" as "disagree" is not misrepresentation? Do you define 'misrepresentation' differently than the average writer?
I have told no one they are going to hell. You brought that up my friend. In fact, I really do not understand your jibberish. You are all over the place?
Reread aliasis' answer. SHE referred to Christians who persecute gays and tell them they're going to hell. No, she didn't (nor did I) personally acuse you of doing that. Rather, she made statements, which you then snarkily misrepresented.
I have read this statement and I gather the same from it each time. Like I said, you are talking gibberish. Do you even understand what you are saying? Of course gay people aren't going to like what the Bible says about being gay. It is an abominati
"So, the bad points are those who disagree with your lifestyle." Ooh, my "lifestyle", classic homophobic response. :) This is why conservative Christianity is losing adherents in America. JThomp42, do you eat shellfish? just wondering.
As a Christian, I hate the sins that people commit. Not the person that commits the sin. I have worked with recovery programs for a long time, and I hear people say if you don't like my life style you don't like me. That is really closed minded.
"Recovery Programs" ..... run by people who think they are more acceptable to "god," for others whom "god" wants to change. ("God" of course being your own, well intentioned maybe but ignorant, egos.)
Jonnycomelately, I never said the recovery programs were Christian in orientation. Your close mindedness made you jump to a conclusion. Thanks for proving my point!
Ok, I stand corrected..... would you like to expand on that, so I know exactly what you mean? I got the impression it was about trying to convert homosexual persons to heterosexual. Was I mistaken?
I have never dealt with that issue, though I have had numerous discussions with gay friends. I've worked with drug, alcohol, sexual addicts, and co-dependency. I have seen the pain caused by these abuses. I believe in love the sinner, hate the sin.
jstfishinman if you can't accept and support your friends for being gay, when it is inherent in them, and literally is about the adult they fall in love with... then I kinda doubt you actually have gay friends.
aliasis .... This an Old Testament question that you are referring to. The answer is null. We do not live under the "old law" any longer. As I do not have an alter in my backyard either.
Yes immoral factions strain moral society. Yes an act that does not perpetuate humanity aids the immoral faction. Moral individuals do not hate. Moral individuals love even the sinner. People need not tolerate moral but they must immoral. Why?
So you think two individuals who love each other, dearly; support each other in their walk through life; support children; assist the community; and have fun between themselves occasionally; are not perpetuating humanity?
No. And you are certainly not elevating humanity.
As far as I am concerned, humanity does not need to be elevated. The "god" you espouse and apparently worship is so small, so worthless, so limited, that I cannot see what you admire in "it." Why are you afraid of such a nonsense god?
It is the little things that make it so easy to Love the teachings of Jesus. It is so very wonderful to be anointed by the Lord's blessing. Those that choose to ignore the small things scour through life never to feel the ecstasy of righteousness.
LOL I'm a lesbian and I'm going to have kids. Biologically. Where's your god now. I imagine you also hate couples that are medically unable to have kids, right? Immoral strain on society? The real strain is people who use religion to persecute.
aliasis, your burden belongs to you alone. your choice is always attributed to you personally. your destiny is fully based on you. you seek equality, yet cannot be equal due to your choice of inequity. Then ask for others to accept inequity as equal.
Nice comment but when you mentioned about Creation science I had to laugh because a lot of public schools teach evolution as a fact when it in actuality is a theory. I heard of creation sci but don't know much about it
I'm really sorry to bring this up to LoisRyan13903, but gravity is a theory.....
Does that mean it doesnt affect us? A theory is based on evidence of aforementioned gravity. It's hard for me to look at CREATION as science, it disregards evidence.
Blessed is the one who trusts in the Lord, who does not look to the proud, to those who turn aside to false gods.
Do you know all these verses by heart, Tabs? Or do you just Google them and find they sound nice? See you in Heaven one day,.....maybe!
Right. I am a Christian. I am not holier than thou. I am not self righteous. I am certainly not perfect. I firmly believe that is what many are intimidated and put off by regarding Christianity. Those who conduct themselves as if they are.
I read the bible daily. I research through the writings to find the one most appropriate verse to the situation. Some people believe that memorization is required, I do not. With memorization, the words get turned or lost. Truth is in living them.
I see no point in using vulgar language to get your point across. Every believer is responsible to proclaim the good news. If you have truly led thirty people to the Lord, they did come to Him "by accident." You should know that.
I am sorry -- what was "vulgar"? And yes you got my point. People do not come to the Lord Christ because they are led. Good news is all we can share.
You wrote: "what to hell are you going to do with it??? But if nobody teaches you how to share it appropriately --- well you are going to make an ass out of yourself and piss other people off." I do not believe you need to use this kind of language.
You sure are judgemental, Glynch. Who cares what language he uses, if it got the point across?
Hell is a biblical word... You dare call God's word Vulgar???
Eric did not use "hell" to describe the place where the unsaved go; he used it in a profane way.
God cares what language Eric uses if he is a Christian. If you knew the Scriptures and believe we ought to obey them, you would agree.
"what to hell are you going to do with it??? " What I wouldn't do is just babble my belief to others...I sought the truth. And I found it. The answer hiding in plain sight that makes all your views make sense. Jesus is the ... SUN!!! Of course.
In my post to you I wrote, " If you have truly led thirty people to the Lord, they did come to Him "by accident." I accidentally omitted the word "not" after "did." People's salvation is certainly not accidental; it was in God's eternal plan for them
glynch, you are certainly increasing my knowledge and I appreciate it. Yes that word accident is not right. It is more divine. We may walk and others may follow, but we can only walk.
I am glad to read your last remark. "Iron sharpens iron." However, I am not certain what your last sentence means.
Eric's statement reads to me as saying that we can only walk for ourselves. Others may follow, but we are only responsible for the steps we take. We can spread the word, but we cannor force others to accept it.
You can lead a horse to water, but...
OK, now I get your meaning.
Others may follow you to Christ, but they must walk their own way and do it of their own volition. we cannot force someone to talk the path to righteousness. We can only continue to focus on our own path
For everyone who asks receives; the one who seeks finds; and to the one who knocks, the door will be opened.
Not the will of the Trinity? So you don't in fact, believe and live all of Jesus words? He clearly had a great commission: tell the world about me, before it perishes...
MOST don't "KNOW" Scripture! They only go by what they've "HEARD" from their popes, priests, pastors, & preachers! MOST don't "LOVE" Jesus & FORGET what HE HAS SAID cuz they're not hearing IT unless 1 ("man") above has said it!
Purely egotistical. You have a way of showing you know it all, while everyone else around you is a fool.
I've "got a way of "STUDYING" Scripture & MOST do not!
I "quote" WORD which is "available to ALL;" therefore, is it *my* fault MOST are too lazy to pick up the Bible & go to GOD for "revelation" in HIS WORD?
II Cor 3:5"Not that we are c
If there was such a god, he would be laughing his head off about you. Thanks for the comedy show.
MY GOD is crying HIS eyes out about you for HE "desires no one is lost" (II Peter 3:9)!
Na na, Norine. Those are tears of laughter. Wake up Dear.
Have a good one.
What do you want me to "wake up" to Jony? Common sense & logic? U see 'they' still can't "figure out" If it's "evolution or creation?" U want me to join them when *HE* "tells me ALL things" which "appears" to be "egotistical" to u? Go Backwar
This sounds like a very reasonable, evidence-based, thoughtful reply based upon observable phenomena we all have experienced. Now, cue irrational superstition-based responses based on Iron-Age era pre-scientific mythological texts. 3...2...1...
Evil entices those too weak to recognize the immoral destructive dangers. Some Christians have also begun to sit humbly and complain rather than continue to spread righteousness. Our nation is being destroyed by ignorance, apathy and complacency.
taberkett, you do realize America was colonized to spread religious TOLERANCE, right? What you say doesn't seem very tolerant.
CroftRoan - Tolerance of evil is considered a crime. This is the foundation of ignorance within the USA society. Through this crime, the moral society is being destroyed. This is evidenced as wild immoral youth beat & kill because they are bored.
Then what about the Crusades? The Salem and English witch trials? Desecration of temple and sites that have been around since before Christianity was born. How is THAT not violent? I have never hurt or killed and I'm not Christian.
Taburkett, the only thing YOU are responsible for is your OWN walk in life, your own moral and ethical standards. Work on that, consistently, deeply, and only then look at what others are about. Not one of us is perfect, yet we live and let live.
The difference between the past and the current - is that we can change the current. However, many who support evil continue to evoke complacency and revoke moral teachings. This is quite true as the society continues a death spiral.
You continue to judge others, from a position of anonymity, a very safe and cowardly place to be. Lift yourself out of that dark, incessant hole you have dug for yourself and find some beauty in the world. There is plenty of it around you.
tebukett, the past is what makes us. Without it we cannot make a better future. It is that same past that makes you see everyone as evil creatures. No one is evil for not believing in a God, any god.
as usual, when someone cannot provide truth, they blast away with unfounded accusations. Those who support evil continue to invoke complacency and revoke moral teachings. Society is highly infected with viral immorality spread through ignorance.
I must therefore give up trying to warm to your opinions, Taburkett. Speaking to a blank wall, it seems. Your response is typical of fanaticism. In my humble opinion, but no doubt you will not have a rational reply. So I will close.
Either taburkett is what s/he appears (a deluded Christian), and/or s/he is a devoted marketer of his/her own Hub. All these responses taburkett supplies could almost be random words picked from a hat full of spiritual phrases. Yet all generate $$$!
the accusations continue much like those spouted about Jesus. "who is this miracle worker and why does he come to our land?" those who disbelieve can never find the path of truth because they are caught up in their personal evil world. truth abounds
Christianity not only teaches "love and compassion" but truth and holiness as well.
True Christians do not oppress anyone; they offer rational, biblical arguments that "gays, atheists" and radical feminists do not accept and cannot answer.
glynch1 - How is your demonization of other human beings "love and compassion?" Your posts contradict themselves. You've got all these different labels for fellow human beings...those "neighbors" you're supposed to be loving. Missing the obvious?
How am I "demonizing" people? The best way to show people you love them is by telling them the truth about God's holiness and their sinfulness. Once they know they are lost, then the love of God comes into play. There is no contradiction. Labels?
glynch1, it is not your job to "show" other people that they are sinners. YOU are not God. People's sin is between themselves and God. YOU have no say in it. If YOU'RE judging and telling people that they are sinners, you are nothing like Jesus.
God uses preachers to announce His judgment upon sinners unless they repent. The Holy Spirit convinces people of their sinfulness, but He uses faithful servants to deliver the message. Jesus certainly spoke of man's sinfulness. UR mistaken.
The best way to show people you love them is to tell them how lost they are? Well glynch buddy, I must love you a whole bunch. Btw - sin is nothing more than a misperception of what IS, not how others aren't living the way your idea of god wants.
Keep telling yourself that glynch1. YOUR delusions are your own. God knows the hearts of all. Your need to feel superior to me and anyone else who disagrees with your delusional views just proves how unlike that which you say you follow. Sorry.
The best way to show that you love others is for your actions to reflect the love that Christ has for us all. This is not just telling others of their sinfulness. This also means letting your actions in helping them show, not just your words.
You have not included all I said. People must come to know they're lost before they will be open to salvation. If they don't learn they are lost, they will think they are OK. I am not superior to you; I'm trying to tell you what I have in Christ.
I stated that you have a need to feel superior to me and to anyone else that disagrees with your views not that you literally are superior. U r coming across as judgmental and holier than thou which is often why so many flee from Christianity glynch1
My motive has nothing to do with feeling superior to anyone. God has commanded Christians to tell people about the Savior, and that is all I am doing. Show me where you think I'm "coming across as 'holier than thou.' I am no better than anyone else.
You are exactly right on that, glynch1, you are no better. That was my very point but obviously it was lost to you. Oh well. If you feel the need to point your finger at sinners so be it, that's your ego trip. Self-righteousness is not Christ-like.
I don't see any self-righteousness and finger pointing. We are all born sinners because of the original sin from Adam and Eve.
If a Christian says someone is a sinner going to hell, it's a helpful/loving statement of fact. If an atheist says there are flaws in the bible, it's mean/hurtful. There is a huge double standard here.
I never stated that I was better than anyone else; I believe you assumed that that was what I meant. I am a sinner saved by the grace of God; I have no righteousness of my own. "Your very point" was not lost to me.
1Timothy6 11 But you, man of God, flee and pursue righteousness, godliness, faith, love, endurance and gentleness. 12 Fight the good fight of faith. Take hold eternal life as you were called through your confession in the presence of many witnesses.
@MT - You guys have some really odd definitions here. But I guess it's like anything. We all define our worlds in a way that will justify the person we want to be and the life we want to live, whether we justify it with religion or something else.
Exactly, M.T. Dremer. Christians can say sinners are going to burn in Hell all day long but if someone challenges that assumption (since they can't prove that) we are misunderstanding them about being judgmental and condemning? Hmm, I see ;)
Moral individuals do not agree with the actions of gays, atheists, and other presentation considered evil in the code of moral standards. These immoral factions should not spend so much time trying to make moral individuals pay for immoral acts.
"These immoral factions should not spend so much time trying to make moral individuals pay for immoral acts." Don't worry, they don't - it's just a pompous person's preoccupation with what others do that makes them uncomfortable.
Religion cannot be used as a code for morality as it has proven itself to contradict with modern moral principles. Every bible-follower is picking and choosing which rules to follow.
I agree MTD. There seems to be a great confusion in people's minds when they try to impose "morality." Like when people in Iraq declare anyone with a sexually different orientation evil, then kill them.... which is more immoral? !!!!
Every immoral individual is picking and choosing what "immoral activity" to declare as moral.
This has created an immoral society filled with boundless corruption and denigration.
Immoral dominance is the last thing this world needs.
You're missing the point, taburkett; there is no ultimate authority on morality. Not the bible, not god, and not religion. All we have is the consensus of the majority on life, love and happiness. That's all we'll ever have.
M. T. Dremer-Christians fundamentally are not on this same page. I'm certain you understand. I also respect your position. Mine as an open-hearted, and open-minded, Christian, is never to judge. Nor certainly to dismiss.
"This has created an immoral society filled with boundless corruption and denigration." Are you part of the immoral society, taburkett? or do you see your self as "better?" Try the mirror technique before answering with another bible-quote.
The immoral corruption in today's society is composed of individuals who wish to destroy the moral principles delivered through the biblical writings. When one seeks to correct such immoral corruption, they are persecuted by the corrupting forces.
Evil begets evil when moral individuals sit back and do nothing to make a difference.
Positive morals must be taught everywhere if society is to advance rather than regress further.
Jesus said He is the only way to God. If He is God, then all other paths lead to destruction, not to life.
Well it's nice that you have blind faith. I'm pretty sure plenary of people are living just fine without religion. You can't possibly even know if there is a God for sure. But if there then I think 90% of the world is screwed. Christians included.
I do not have blind faith. I know God exists because He makes Himself known to us through creation. People may be "living just fine without religion," but they do not have the life of God in them. So, in reality, they have nothing worth anything.
“But if a wicked person turns away from all the sins they have committed and keeps all my decrees and does what is just and right, that person will surely live; they will not die.
"Sin" merely means a misperception, and while you think of it as things that don't adhere to what you're taught, I see you're full of them. Take a lesson from experience why don't you?
Totally agree with you the God sent to us many messengers and each one has a message must transfered to his people. Then everyone can choose his messenger if he convainct by the requirements of the religion wich want to follow.
Agree! Great points, jonny.
When the wicked thrive, so does sin, but the righteous will see their downfall.
Who is wicked? No one is wicked. You're delusional. Don't you know God never made any other but a saint?
Agree Jonny. Christin-not a believer-make a very respectable comment. There are other nonbelievers who like to put Christians down
Jonny, you preach arrogance, yet say little. I on the other hand operate through empathy to all who are found within my realm. God puts lost souls on a path that crosses mine so that they receive assistance. Love abounds in God's realm through me.
Will "peace, love, and harmony" save your Muslim friends? Whatever happened to the truth of the gospel? Perhaps we should learn and believe the gospel first, then we will realize that they are lost without a saving knowledge of Christ.
Keep reminding God’s people of these things. Warn them before God against quarreling about words; it is of no value, and ruins those who listen. present yourself to God as one approved, a worker who is not ashamed who correctly handles the truth.
Ok, I will. Jesus is the SUN and we are ALL HEIRS to THIS KINGDOM. He travels with 12 zodiac disciple friends revealing what TRULY IS, PERFORMING MIRACLES and spreading his LIGHT to ALL. Your gospel doesn't hold up to what we are all FREE to SEE!!
There you go speaking like the Muslims in the Middle East are behaving. You wanting everyone to believe in the gospel and the Muslims wanting everyone to believe in the Quran.
Peace, Love and Harmony are the constant truth of our God glynch1,
We are engaged in spiritual battle between truth and error. The gospel is the only written revelation of the true God; the Koran is written by a spiritually deceived man. The truth will win in the end.
2 Timothy 2:19
Nevertheless, God’s solid foundation stands firm, sealed with this inscription: “The Lord knows those who are his,” and, “Everyone who confesses the name of the Lord must turn away from wickedness.”
Evil Individuals campaign under the guise of religion so they can persuade others to follow their evil empire. Those who follow the 10 commandments live through righteous love. Individuals must choose their path. Love is the straight alley.
That may be true (although I've heard peaceful preachers say that "Homosexuals and Jews are God's children, but they're going to Hell when they die.") your question was why is everyone afraid of Christianity and that is the answer.
taburkett, since no one is able to have a real debate without you hiding behind the mother's skirt of the Bible. I am done. I won't try to explain that choice is gift to man because you don't want to hear that. Let us live in peace and blessed be.
God's children do not run from evil. They work to overcome the evil. Tolerance is provided as long as the evil subsides, but when it expands, it must be overcome once again. Evil does not follow truth so it will never overtake righteousness.
"Evil Individuals campaign under the guise of religion so they can persuade others to follow their evil empire. " Does this apply to you, Taburkett? You sound like a wolf in disguise to me.......
as usual - jonnycomelately - you choose to depict someone or something based on a biased opinion rather than the truth. You challenge through a reflection rather than truthful symmetry. Wisdom eludes those who live thru bias because truth is absent.
I guess Gods children are nowhere to be found in abundance. The ones I know seem to repress or run from evil..
1 Timothy 6:20
Timothy, guard what has been entrusted to your care. Turn away from godless chatter and the opposing ideas of what is falsely called knowledge,
What's entrusted in your care is your own life's experience. What's falsely called knowledge is people babbling from books, instead of speaking what they've learned from experience to be true. You know scripture but nothing of their lessons.
And taburkett, you still continue to hide behind anonymity, rarely telling us your own, honest, personal take on life. Resorting to spouting biblical quotes is utterly pointless. Unintelligent rhetoric. IMO.
I know that I have saved individuals from immoral life through righteous living and teaching. I know that ignorance breeds babble inflicting evil upon innocent individuals. I know that removing God from schools has brought more evil to the USA.
"I know that I have saved individuals from immoral life through righteous living and teaching." Thus thought the Pharisees, but your Jesus saw through their self-righteousness.
OMG. In the USA pledge, Under God was added in 1967 (approximately)... Do tell how me how adding God made society any way visibly better? Better for who?
This is just too harsh. And over generalizing. But too true to. It is hard to be Christian and not tell others how to be Christian. So we slip up. Then we should repent. Love one another is the only acceptable Christian doctrine.
Agree: Some Christians mistakenly think that God has called them to "bring in the kingdom." Disagree: God is the Creator Who has given commandments about sexuality. Most true Christians agree on the fundamentals. Muslims are not spiritual brethren.
Glynch you said Muslims are not spiritual. That is a sweeping generalisation, what is your definition of spiritual?
I said that Muslims are not the spiritual brethren of true Christians. They reject Jesus as God; they do not believe in His substitutionary atonement; they try to earn heaven by doing "good works" so they do not belong to the family of God.
Glynch, isn't it written that Jesus is the SON of God? Where are you getting the "Jesus is God" bit from?
The righteous detest the dishonest; the wicked detest the upright.
“Every [Christian] sect is a certificate that God has not plainly revealed His will to man. To each reader the Bible conveys a different meaning."
-Robert G. Ingersoll quoted in The Christian Delusion: Why Faith Fails (p. 182).
glynch1 said: "God is the Creator Who has given commandments about sexuality." I DISAGREE! Individual humans like you, glynch1, determine the "laws" about sexuality.... in order to "lord it" over others. No god involved, except in your own mind.
Wisdom is derived from acceptance of responsibility to righteousness, love, and understanding. This is gained through positive advancement under truthful research. It requires the individual to adhere to moral principles rather than devious ones.
I'll agree that wisdom begins with truth, but not just truthful "research". You have to be honest with yourself to be able to learn from what's happening around you. Wisdom is derived from knowledge, and knowledge only from direct experience.
I have seen it all. A biblicist literalist being a truther. Let me chew on that one. OK -- I admit I cannot get my brain around it. Ouch. Either Faith or what you can discern. Or even have faith in what you discern. But this is too strange.
Have you never heard of the Trinity? Jesus is God the Son, the Second Person of the Triune Godhead. He is co-equal with God the Father and God the Holy Spirit.
I totally agree with this statement. Christianity is supposed to be an all inclusive religion that is open to all people that want to be part of it. Unfortunately, some Christians want to make it sctrictly exclusive tp ensure that only they get in.
I do not know what you mean by a "proud" Christian. You also have to define what you mean by "God loves all and accepts all." The Church should provide a general call to everyone so that more people might be saved. Your last point baffles me.
Ever hear a "Christian" express reservations about homosexuals? Non-Christians? Atheists? Even hostility and disdain for such people?
I have. Most of us have.
That's what I'm talking about.
Yes. Some Christians allow their flesh to control their actions and attitudes toward these groups. The Church should boldly speak the truth but do so in love, having the hope that some of them might be saved.
glynch1-I think we're on the same page as brothers in Christianity. I have advanced degrees from two different private faith-based institutions. My belief in the power of God and Jesus Christ is profound. So is my capacity for independent thought.
Job 34:37 To his sin he adds rebellion; scornfully he claps his hands among us &multiplies his words against God.
2Timothy 2:25 Opponents must be gently instructed, so that God will grant them repentance leading them to a knowledge of the truth,
Happy Man great comment but not all Christians are judgmental towards homosexuals, atheists, other religions. I have friends who are homosexuals and I don't judge them. I do pray for them Love the sinner hate the sin
taburkett & LoisRyan13903-Right with both you guys. Please do not lose my point. I am talking about the militant, close-minded extreme Christian right who shun all but those THEY accept as righteous. Christ did not teach "selective" love, yes?
Gods love has no boundaries. Individuals exert their own boundaries through self-imposed restrictions by embracing evil. This is easily viewed as immoral individuals seek to gather others through devious actions. Truth always outlasts the devious act
"Individuals exert their own boundaries through self-imposed restrictions..." you're making a great example of this, telling us who's wicked and evil and the like, when "God's love has no boundaries"... yet somehow, you keep finding some. Hmm...
2 Timothy 2:16 Avoid godless chatter, because those who indulge in it will become more and more ungodly. 17 Their teaching will spread like gangrene.
*laughing* - This reminds me of people from any religion who insist that their way is the only right way, and that their definitions are the only right ones. We've got a few of those on here. And yes, the more they insist, the more ungodly they feel.
No one who practices deceit will dwell in my house; no one who speaks falsely will stand in my presence.
Jesus claimed to be the only way to God; His resurrection proved His deity. He said the gate is narrow that leads to eternal life. Paganism and witchcraft are on the broad way that leads to destruction. Christians must speak the truth in love.
You do realize that many of the practices of Christianity were based off of Pagan beliefs, right? Many European/Middle Eastern cultures are cousins of each other and are built from the last generation of beliefs.
Why tiptoe? Did you think that you were wrong? Or, did you not want to hear what others were saying? Wise adults learn through exchange with others. Running away never provides an answer.
Yeah...I'm sure the victims of the Salem Witchhunts could've saved themselves through calm, rational conversation. Or the citizens of Iraq, or victims of domestic abuse....oh, if only they were wise enough...
The "I AM" refers to the inner self, the place where divine consciousness resides within each of us. Jesus was speaking of this. It really IS the way, the truth and the life. YOU got it wrong, glynch1.
Johnny I just wrote a bit on "I Am" in my last article :)
@Johnny - I agree. The "I Am" is what Jesus was referring to when he talked about "heaven within." And spiritual leaders from other spiritual traditions have said the same thing. Religions are spiritual teachings in different languages and ages.
But if from there you seek the Lord your God, you will find him if you seek him with all your heart and with all your soul.
Love that old testament. I can't even imagine how hard these guys had it before Jesus.
Witchcraft brings out God's Compassion (Not)
Exodus 22:18 (KJV), "Thou shalt not suffer a witch to live."
Galatians 5:19-21 (KJV), "Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, ... WITCHCRAFT [emphasis mine], ... a
taburkett the reason why I tiptoe around friends and family is because I don't want them to ignore my side of the argument and tell me that I'm wrong and going to hell because I don't practice Christianity.
Croftroan, This is the right place to air the angst. It is safe here. I do not know your troubles but I have empathy towards you. You are right to have your feelings. Others are wrong to tell you how to feel. Thank you for sharing them.
Again taburkett quotes a verse from the Old Testament, totally out of context from the passage it was written in, and expects this to somehow "guide" us into his/her way of thinking. Crazy!
Some people believe that moral actions are determined through complacency because mankind has improved technologically. However, regardless of decade, if one seeks the Lord they will experience a wonderful life. Truth outlasts all criticism.
Wait a second. TA Burkett. hides it's identity and professes Christianity? Totally fully wrong. Anonymous is great for certain things but just plain wrong for a Christian.
Taburkett, at phases in my life I have sought The Lord and at other phases I have not sought The Lord. The difference in my life experience? Absolutely none.
Disappearinghead - I must disagree with your analysis. Since you can tell the difference between your phases, there is a specific variance. Therefore, others also can determine this variant also. Life experience therefore is different.
The only variation in life is whether you wish to be a Lazy Christian and wait on God to do everything for you or if you understand Phil 4:13 as well as faith without works is dead and understand you have the power to do things on your own
True Christians practice the apostles' teachings; they do not follow pagan beliefs. Roman Catholicism, not Christianity, is a combination of pagan beliefs and practices alongside a veneer of the Bible. You are referring to that system.
Glynch1, please do your research.. The thing with the resurrection, is it is an event that literally cannot be substantiated.... It's hilarious, no body left, oh-must be resurrected!
Two to three hundred years ago (the early 1700s and 1800s) most Americans still took a high view of Scripture; we were a biblically literate nation. We sought to win others to Christ because we saw unbiblical religions as false, yet we did not hate.
What? Have you read any Native or Black American history? What do you mean, we did not hate??? We did then and we still do.
Do you have any evidence of true believers murdering "Indians" and blacks? The true Church sends missionaries to win native Americans and Africans to Christ; it does not murder them.
First) define true Christian
Second) read a history textbook
In short, a true Christian is one who has trusted Jesus as his personal Lord and Savior. Whom do you consider to be "true Christians"? Many historians approach the subject as secular humanists and revisionists; their work is biased, not trustworthy.
1 Timothy 6:11 But you, man of God, pursue righteousness, godliness, faith, love, endurance and gentleness. Take hold of the eternal life to which you were called when you made your good confession in the presence of many witnesses.
Where did Jesus say that each of us has access to our own spiritual guidance? If you refer to "the kingdom of God is within you," you are misinterpreting Him. He was talking to Pharisees--people to whom this saying does not relate.
Are you saying his word is not a Living Word? Most good Christians would disagree with you. There's no reason why anyone should not interpret heaven being within as applying to themselves. He didn't segregate his teachings, but gave them to all.
The verse reads "The kingdom of God is in your midst." Jesus as the King is standing among them, and the Pharisees were not aware of it because they had rejected Him. How can heaven reside within people who hate the King? Interpret in context.
glynch1 How many steps removed from what's happening NOW do you BELIEVE the TRUTH to be? "To know what's happening, you first must know this obscure story then interpret it within the context of another person's story and.." no. You just have to be.
You sound very much like a Pharisee, glynch1
I have found that folks who cannot refute what the Scriptures say and prove their point with sound evidence resort to ad hominem attacks. If you wish to discuss the text, jonny, I am willing to do so. If you want to attack me, then I will not play.
The Pharisees could not see themselves in the mirror.
They do not speak peaceably, but devise false accusations against those who live quietly in the land.
Here's something interesting - a TED talk from neuroscientist who watched herself having a stroke. She describes a beautiful spiritual experience she had and what caused it. http://www.ted.com/talks/jill_bolte_taylor_s_power...
Although I would not doubt that some KKK members are horribly misguided believers, I seriously doubt that many of their members are true believers in Christ. Painting a caricature of Christians as black-hating warmongerers is not constructive.
Peace loving non-Christians are afraid of Christian hypocrisy. You know the saying once burned twice shy? The world has been burned and pillaged in Jesus' name one too many times. Trust is a hard thing to regain when lost so drastically.
Not all Christians are Bible-thumping hypocrites. But the non-Christians who have been exposed to those types of people it is understanding why they are afraid or standoffish to all Christians. I would call the U.S a conglomeration of all religion
The wicked flee though no one pursues, but the righteous are as bold as a lion.
I agree with you Credence2.
Proverbs16:9 The heart of man plans his way, but the Lord establishes his steps.
Psalm106:3 Blessed are they who observe justice, who do righteousness at all times!
1 Corinthians4:20 For the kingdom of God does not consist in talk but in power.
True. And that includes those pseudo-Christians who tell other people they're wrong if they're not Christian. They don't know. Only the individuals themselves can know what's right or wrong for their lives.
CroftRoan,taburkett, and watergeek, thanks for sharing your take on my comment!
1 Timothy 4:6 If you point these things out to brothers and sisters, you will be a good minister of Christ Jesus, nourished on truths, faith, and good teaching that you have followed.
1Timothy5:15Some have in fact already turned away to follow Satan.
How is telling someone the good news of redemption "pushing my religion on anyone else"? If you truly believe the gospel is the truth, you should want to share this treasure with everyone you know. God has given you the right/responsibility to do so.
guard what has been entrusted to your care. Turn away from godless chatter and the opposing ideas of what is falsely called knowledge, 21 which some have professed and in so doing have departed from the faith.
Welcome to HubPages.
Religion is not always inherently about faith in the power of love and compassion.
I am not always called by faith. Too often I am called by devotion. This thing called "religion" more often than not stands in my way. But Love never obstructs. I am not good. I am sorry. But I try. Sometimes I do not want to believe, so I can sleep.
How timely - my newest post is on "devotion" - particularly how to use it functionally instead of exhaustingly. Though it's tied to the zodiac, it transcends any one religion: http://leetea.hubpages.com/hub/Virgos-Second-Decan...
Psalm 34: 12-14
12 Whoever of you loves life and desires to see many good days,
13 keep your tongue from evil and your lips from telling lies.
14 Turn from evil and do good; seek peace and pursue it.
Worship God and be delivered into the Holy Realm.
Doing that to my fullest - living in heaven here and now. Your book quips written by someone else really don't hold any weight to my life's lessons. I worship the creator by creating...think about the sense that makes.
Those that do believe know that God is love. And, that if we live in love, then God is in us and delivered through us. Society is composed of evil that man does because they do not live in love. For the upright walk blameless while the evil does not
I believe, I'm just not Xtian. My Gods are love. Love isn't being arrogant telling others what to believe, forcing them to live by your beliefs. That's pride & arrogance. Society is composed of people who deserve free will and beliefs to be respe
True Christians have committed "hate crimes" against homosexuals? Can you provide an example of such a hate crime?
How can you possibly declare who is and isn't a true Christian, with all respect? Popes were considered true catholics, but committed vulgar acts towards young children... The lines between them blur when it's an opinion in all technicality.
There are various tests that we cannot get into here. "By their fruits you will know them" is one of them.
I do not know of one Pope who taught justification by faith alone.
You lost me in your last sentence. Whose questions are you answering ?
My very point is that you can't say who isn't and is a true follower... It is a matter of opinion. Therefore, you cannot ask an example of a hate crime by true christians. Christians R Christians; whether or not you think they are true is an opinion.
Of course you can say who is a true christian and who isn't! A true Christian not only has and professes a faith in Jesus' teachings - but they also behave in a christian manner. They live by the teachings.
That simply is not true. Where in the Bible does it tell us to decide who is a true Christian or not. That is a rabbit out of the hat magic trick. You cannot tell me how to act Christian.
Therefore let us move beyond the elementary teachings about Christ and be taken forward to maturity, not laying again the foundation of repentance from acts that lead to death, and of faith in God,
Many are the woes of the wicked, but the Lord’s unfailing love surrounds the one who trusts in him.
Morality is maintained by the individual. When immoral is substituted for this maintenance, society is degraded. When immoral is exposed to children, society degrades exponentially. Truth is-freedom exists-demons destroy-God repairs. Bless Morality.
I have taken an oath and confirmed it, that I will follow your righteous laws.
You have not provided all the facts of the case--only your side of the story. If these folks had accusations against you, they should have followed Scripture (Matthew 18).
They probably would not have allowed an unbeliever to serve in the church.
They had no accusations against me. They made it up! Sorry you can't see the light!
I have no trouble seeing the light. Can you not see that you have presented a one-sided story? How can I judge the facts if I have no contribution from the other side?
Glynch. I didn't ask you to judge me. I answered the question what is the problem in today's society. This was not at a church by the way. :)
I am first trying to determine if these folks are "persecuting" you "under a false understanding of the Bible" and second, if this example constitutes "the prolem in today's society." Without hearing their side, I cannot agree or disagree with you.
Well all that really mattered is that it happened to me! It's a good thing I am grounded in my Faith though. I was able to forgive and move on.
"They probably would not have allowed an unbeliever to serve in the church." He prob meant that they would not welcome people of other faiths some places are like that. Dump them and find a new home
And when you stand praying, if you hold anything against anyone, forgive them, so that your Father in heaven may forgive you your sins.
"A god who is all-knowing and all-powerful and who does not even make sure his creatures understand his intention— could that be a god of goodness? Who allows countless doubts and dubieties to persist, for thousands of years, as though the salvation
Very well said. it's true about some Christians therefore they assume all Christians are like that
Thx...I hear all these things about church from people who never go. And then on Sunday, no matter what parish I attend, I always say "why don't I ever see any of this". Usually, neither do ant-Christians. Some people are just easy targets.
What about those of us who have actually gone to church? Who have learned the stories and the histories?
What about them ??? I am there most Sundays and haven't seen this abundance of hypocrites that some claim to see. All I see are warm, friendly and extremely generous people.
Most (all?) I know who have issues with Christianity were raised Christian/Catholic. I was confirmed, was raised in the church for over 20 years, then left. Not all derive perspective from ignorance or fear. I have experience across the spectrum.
Those who have achieved wisdom through the path of righteousness work as prescribed by the Lord for the goodness of the society.
Those that question it have not acquired the wisdom but have acquiesced to conformance.
I know numerous people who were raised agnostic, atheist or totally different faith that never stepped foot into a Christian church and take issue with Christianity. Not sure where you attend. But there is nothing fearful about my parish priest.
You said it astounded you how many people who never go to church think they have insight into what goes on. I came to also point out there are many who were raised in churches that DO have this insight from direct experience.
Perhaps some do have a backround raised around faith. But a whole lot don't And many went to church because their parents made them and never paid attention, so they know little about the faith they were raised in. Most couldn't name the stations
Again, not all derive perspective from ignorance or fear. Some know fully the ways of the church, and still have come to view it unfavorably. Your argument that those who don't understand your faith must be ignorant bigots is inaccurate.
What's bigoted is to assume that people only follow the church out of fear and ignorance. I fear nothing about God and still attend mass.
A skeptic or nonbeliever seldom finds truth within the righteous path because they reject wisdom of the Spirit. Those lacking wisdom of the Spirit do not find rapture of the quality of being morally right. This leads to disjointed negativism.
Can you give me an example of such people? Why would they defend Him if no one were attacking Him?
Maybe the atheist killed in his name, or the gays that are screamed to in the name of him on street corners. Just a couple of quick examples.
I do not know about the murder you reference, but I gather that the screaming you mention refers to the Westboro group. I agree with you; their attitudes and actions are repulsive and hateful. True Christians do not act this way.
Sure. How about the bogus "war on Christmas"? How about the people standing outside abortion clinics or gay wedding receptions with portraits of Jesus, acting out the hatred he never preached?
When the righteous thrive, the people rejoice; when the wicked rule, the people groan.
Most people who stand outside abortion clinics are pleading with the women not to abort their babies. How is this an act of hatred? I abhor any true hatred of people, but stand with those who wish to save the unborn from death.
So attract and do not detract.
taburkett your habit of simply quoting verses from the bible is not very enlightening. I suppose your "faith," i.e., belief in magic, says the holy spirit will infuse us readers with enlightenment. I don't think so!
I just think it is weird. It is like using scripture like a witch. Or those old Vampire movies.
lol is that what's happening here? Taburkett's posts have become like irrelevant commercials to ignore. "Buy this, buy that - buy into this, buy into that"... You're citing a book that was written by humans, it's as relevant as anyone else's ideas.
Nice comment kalinin1158 but not all abortion protesters are like that. one near where I live and the Christians stand nearby-respectfully away from the clinic pray for both the unborn babies and the girls-even for the ones who go thru with it
Morality in society provides a positive environment where love abounds. However, current support for immoral acts has led to a highly degraded society. Individual responsibility requires a solid code of moral standards. Truth secures this.
Really? Life is just horrible? You need to go help someone. You will find another who does it everyday. Life does not suck raw eggs. It is beautiful. Or perhaps you cannot see or be part of that?
Murder on the rise-Aborted babies eyes-someone denies-
society is degrading-the devil is abound-someone denies-by closing their eyes
it is a sad day-as evil enters the abode-we can fix it with morals-if everyone morally rode
the time is come friend
When I use my eyes to see my day, I see birds and crickets and quenching rain. No murder, no dead babies do I see - I learn of war, illness, famine from TV. The creator's creation all around me, the devil only distraction from where we be. LOOK!
Your paranoia about an evil world really is a sickness, I suspect. Utterly distorted view. Keep it to yourself. Just don't drag others down with you. See a doctor.
the despair of the demonic world has led to compulsive lying we witness everyday
yet many deny such is happening
the path of righteousness is the only way to overcome the demon
united in morals mankind will sustain a moral society.
where do you stand
You are welcome to dig your own grave, Taburkett. I prefer to walk this world and experience it's joys, every day, even enjoying the flowers of the grave yard. Thank you.
Holy Rollers are terrifying, but people in foreign countries are not as receptive to Christian Religion. Also here in the USA there are many people afraid of the Christian Religion. =)
Jim, that's not exactly what I meant. God knows His people in any denomination. As the Bible says, there will be many that are lost, some of those will be church attenders. The denominational tags will have no effect on God knowing His children.
lol you are right
Are you accusing me of being an unbeliever? That's how your comment to me came across.
What part of my comment makes you think this?
The part where you say they probably would not have allowed an unbeliever to serve in the church. It wasn't a church. I am a believer. That's why I was serving at the Christian facility. :)
You have misunderstood my meaning. I said that the organization probably would not have hired an unbeliever, so the mistreatment you allege would not have happened to him or her.
But from everlasting to everlasting the Lord’s love is with those who fear him, and his righteousness with their children’s children—
Crafty, glynch isn't calling you an unbeliever; he's calling you a liar. Hilarious to me how Christians' crass abrasiveness crashes across all bounds of propriety and civility and yet they cringe at the thought of people avoiding them! Deep delusion.
"God has given all Christians the wonderful responsibility...." another self-interest delusion!
When encountering disbelievers, morality must seek to avoid disturbing their immoral thoughts because they become incensed beyond personal control. This leads to eruption of vigorous immoral paganism deemed a rejection of conjecture. Blessed be God.
Why does it seem like taburkett is answering with MadLibs?
Moral Christians protect others who cannot protect themselves. Some call this fighting but it is simply a level of protection required to oppose the tyrants that attempt to control others. The USA tyrant politicians control through welfare slavery.
And I saw something else under the sun: In the place of judgment—wickedness was there, in the place of justice—wickedness was there.
The only judgement I see here is those of the Christians. Well that and my notice of your delusions. What if, long ago, satan overtook the church and decided to turn all their followers into mindless babbling idiots, disconnecting them from reality?
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Taburkett's question was answered numerous times, but he was unable to open his eyes to the "truth" he was seeking. Inner truth. Instead it was self-deception, ego and ignorance. Pathetic but he's left HP. Others have replaced him. Same old....
Puritanical and simplistic. No substance to your opinion as I see it. You demonstrate one more reason that people are afraid of christianity.... many practitioners do not present intelligent discussions.
JOENOLT you are correct. The immoral corruption grows exponentially as the complacent individuals in society cheer them on. These individuals sleepwalk through unawareness of the actual dangers and degradation being harvested.
Compared to most other religious systems, Christianity is quite new. There is a fear of change in all people that deals completely in survival. In order for new cultures to thrive they must take pieces of the old ways. Christianity is no different.
Are you saved by grace through believing and faith, or by obeying God's law?
its what you believe that you will obey
No one can keep God's law perfectly; God gave it to man so that we might come to the knowledge of our sin and turn to Christ for forgiveness and justification before God. Unsaved humanity will always reject God's law because that is their nature.
I don't think it is honest or right to say that. Many people you will never see in a church love God, love you and will pray for from thousand of miles without anyone knowing about their greatness> Essence or appearance is the question. Love, peac
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Brent, you imply that bigotry and judgment is rampant in the Christian faith. Yet much of the intolerance stated by Christians reflects intolerance to immoral acts. One cannot truly follow the Christian doctrine if they support immoral activities.
abusive authority occurs when evil adults invade the normally safe church. it becomes enormously vindictive when the elders do not recognize the invasion. when this happens, your tale of despair occurs. I pray daily that you are blessed with love.
While "Turn or burn" communicates truth--one must repent or one will spend eternity in the Lake of fire-- it exhibits a wrong attitude toward preaching the gospel; it shows no love for the sinner. Christians must learn to "speak the truth in love."
1 Timothy 4 For everything God created is good, and nothing is to be rejected if it is received with thanksgiving, 5 because it is consecrated by the word of God and prayer.
"...spend eternity in the Lake of fire..." you are free to believe this for yourself, but you are not entitled to preach it to others. It's your religion, nothing more nothing less. An ugly concentration on judgment.
I have a message from God in my heart concerning the sinfulness of the wicked:There is no fear of God before their eyes.
2 In their own eyes they flatter themselves too much to detect or hate their sin.
Evil abounds in the USA.
The whole "lake of fire and eternal damnation and torment" mentioned in the KJV bible is actually biblically inaccurate in the face of the original versions of the bible (Greek, hebrew, and aramic). King James added it in his to exert control by fear
God has given His people the responsibility to proclaim the good news to the whole world. I see no concentration on judgment in the gospel; I see a perfect blending of judgment and grace. May God open your eyes.
Divine Comedy may have contributed
I agree with you about the bible being a blend of judgment and grace. The biggest issue is that a most of the more vocal Christians are preaching judgment but not teaching grace. IMO, this is what's turning people away from Christ
Which "vocal Christians" focus on judgment? If they neglect to bring in the solution to sin, then they are unbalanced.
If you look around HP, you will see a lot of unbalanced Christians. This doesn't make them less Christian, IMO, but these "unbalanced" ones are presenting themselves as the true representatives of Christianity.
Did you respond to my question, "Which "vocal Christians" focus on judgment?" with "You." If you did, where did you get that idea? Read my posts. I constantly talk about the grace and love of Christ.
Try again -- who is sinful??? Make a judgment or not, your choice. Maybe it is your place to decide. It is not a "gift" given to me. What is a sin? Hate. Who hates? Not mine to determine. But if "I" hate -- I repent. That is my only right.
Again, I cannot determine what comment or question you are responding to. I only know you did not clearly answer mine. All people are sinners, and all people need the Savior.
You miss the point. All are sinners, between their heart and God/Trinity. That is scripture. It is not for you to call out. You got no right to call it out. Nobody gave you the right to call me a sinner. That is between me and my God - not you.
I agree, Eric. I've tried pointing this very thing out to glynch1 but he says that I'm mistaken. He feels as though it is his right to call out sinners, I say it is God's place and no other.
As I have said before, Christ has commissioned His Church to proclaim the gospel to the whole world. The gospel includes making known humanity's lostness in sin. Where you get the idea that the Church has no part in this matter?
The flaw in this whole argument is that humans, individuals, have chosen what to accept/reject in the business of "spreading the word." It comes down to a self-appointed commission. No god told you to do it.
I am a friend to all who fear you, to all who follow your precepts.
I'm not talking about church, glynch1. I'm talking about you, as a human, if you are telling others that they are sinners and are going to Hell, it's not your place to make that judgment. That's God's job. Not yours, as a human. That is my point.
"'Turn or burn' communicates truth--one must repent or one will spend eternity in the Lake of fire--" -glynch1
Why an "eternity" burning? Why not make a punishment that fits the sin/crime? & Forgiveness requires an innocent person's punishment? H
The entire matter of judgment rests upon there being, in reality, a "god" that sits in judgment and that "god" is waiting until after each of physical death to meet out the judgment. For me: No reality after my death.
Reality of the spirit is shown through signs in every living thing. As each living organism wanders toward its demise, the signs come more quickly. This then provides the period of spirit lifting through sacrifice of the despondent one.
"Sacrifice of the despondent one"? TA, you gonna do that? Sacrifice the despondents are ya? Do you know how to skin a buck? I do...straight to the freezer. God taught me.
2 Peter 2:10 This is especially true of those who follow the corrupt desire of the flesh and despise authority. Bold and arrogant, they are not afraid to heap abuse on celestial beings;
Not against what you have commented here, Rajan... but maybe that missionary zeal is a manifestation of the inherent need in many humans to worship a Higher Power. That need is then exploited by people with ulterior motives....... just a thought.
The immoral spread with zeal and yet many simply challenge those who seek to distribute morality. The society is rapidly sinking immorally to its lowest depths and yet many do not reject the immoral. This leads to radical advancement of other immoral
I guess I just realized it. TABurkett scares me. So I figure I now get it. Many Christians scare me.
The lack of personal responsibility to support moral actions has led to the degradation of society. Man can never make immoral equal to moral unless society becomes immoral. Society is growing more immoral each year as demonic activity expands.
If you truly loved Christ, then you would turn from Hinduism. Jesus is the only way to a truly personal God; He demands total allegiance.
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The simplistic idea that christianity holds the key to morality I reject, 100%. All I see in support of that idea is ignorancy, superstition and religiosity.
AMEN: "..you can't be yourself without being a sinner or a bad person.." For WE love ourselves (or what WE want) more than GOD! WE "..love the creation more than the CREATOR." (Rm 1:25)
II Chron 7:14 "...shall HUMBLE themselves & turn fm their w
Definitely not the largest. In fact, they are probably a small minority whose conversions are suspect.
If I speak of fairness but do not have love for all, I am but a resounding gong or a clanging cymbal. If I am learned with knowledge, and if I have a faith that can move mountains, but do not have love, I am nothing. Love thy neighbor as thyself.
After reading many of your comments on this thread gentlemen you two really need to look into your own hearts. You seem to be armed with the bible and Christianity and I have had my fill of religious warriors. Peace!
When one person tells another person to look inward, it normally means that the teller has faults that lie within. This is due to reversal attrition where the spoken one has utilized their own faulty precepts in formation of their request.
Taburkett, you can't help yourself can you. I know I have faults and often look inward it's called being human. You just don't seem to realize what you are doing is not bringing people to Christianity but driving them away.
Maybe the problem is centred in narrow-mindedness: limiting "god" to what a person wants him/her/it to be, or to represent. That "god" then limits the believer. The opposite would be infinite potential.
Personal responsibility requires the individual to accept truth about themselves. Some easily achieve this while others deny it constantly. For those who deny, life is always wicked. This leads them to denounce truth regardless of its impact.
With your logic (telling stories and behaving well equals proof that Jesus is God), why not believe in any of the other thousands of religions out there, such as Buddhism, Hinduism, Islam, Judaism, Mormonism? You don't understand the word "proof".
Walk the path of righteousness and those who desire wisdom will follow your example. It does not take much effort when you simply display the way of the Lord. Truth is the easy path because it is not built upon corruption and deceit.
Bible is all the proof I need
God always takes the simplest way. Albert Einstein
My religion consists of a humble admiration of the illimitable superior spirit who reveals himself in the slight details we are able to perceive with our frail and feeble mind. Albert Einstein
"My position concerning God is that of an agnostic." Albert Einstein
"No man can deny the fact that Jesus existed, nor that his sayings are beautiful."
"No one can read the Gospels without feeling the actual presence of Jesus. His personality pulsates in every word. No myth is filled with such life."Einstein
Albert Einstein was also influenced by the world in which he grew up and mature.... to leave his mark, having had a very curious, searching brain. He apparently had his shortcomings, like any human, but was also highly intelligent.
"The word God is for me nothing more than the expression and product of human weaknesses, the Bible a collection of honourable, but still primitive legends which are nevertheless pretty childish." Einstein, the agnostic non-Christian.
Einstein has a lot of quotes that can be used on both sides of the GOD argument. For anyone to say how this intellectual viewed God is impossible.
I like to think maybe all of Einstein's theories were developed trying to figure out what happens to us when we die.
I like to think Einstein was speaking of the righteousness that is conveyed by those who truly worship in a manner that follows the teachings of Jesus. Humans cannot ascertain the variable elements of the universe, let alone denote their afterlife.
@JAngel: Yes! "You will know them by their fruit." (Matt 7:15). I cont to ask unbelievers,"What other book has prophesied yrs ago prophecies "seen" in our age i.e. 9/11 as in Is 9/10?" Isn't it coincidental? No one resp just gives excuse(s)!
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Then again how may Christians have been persecuted and killed by people of other religions? The same with the cults-such as Jim Jones-that claim to be Christian and have mass suicides? Good comment though
Humans subjugate, animals subjugate, even nature subjugates, but God does not subjugate. Christian religion like other religions has been used by evil beings to do many bad things. But that does not make the religion bad. My God teaches love for all.
Individual responsibility is not taught in schools. Schools teach tolerance to immoral acts and rejection of moral principles. That is why evil is growing within the schools. That is why kids follow the path of immoral tolerance. Judgmentalism - not.
Of whose morality do you speak?
Morality is presented in true moral principles
Moral principles are not ideas by "whose dialog" but solid presentation of ethics
Ethics promote positive utility to society
I.E. gay marriage does not promote positive utility
Thus immoral to society.
Presented by whom?
presented in wisdom by those who have attained it.
but as seen here - questioned continually by those that have not.
Questioned continually due to continually evasive answers.
the only evasion is composed of false care frontations attempting a hijack through slack wisdom.
Truth is the easy path because it requires no such false attainment.
You have yet to answer my original question. What are YOU scared of?
I am not scared - I am concerned that complacency will lead to further immoral destruction of the society. I am concerned that this will lead to destruction of the USA. I am concerned that our youth will die much before their time. are you concerned?
I am concerned about anyone trying to impose HIS own morality on anyone who doesn't conform to it.
no one imposes - truth begets truth
but evil thrives on ignorance.
faith is a true path to individual thinking.
faith leads to solid moral ethics.
moral principles and solid ethics provides a moral society.
this is the desire - this is the need
"...faith leads to solid moral ethics..."
For the fourth time: whose moral ethics? Why won't you answer such a simple question?
You will never break down his/her barrier of self-imposed morality. A waste of time and energy trying to.
society morals are generated through truth concerning right and wrong.
evil opposes truth and degrades society
those that support evil continue to drive for immoral teachings to youth
tolerance to immoral acts continues to grow as apathy expands
Can you define "society morals?"
Can you define "evil?"
society morals = truth concerning right and wrong.
evil = wicked, bad, wrong, immoral, sinful, foul, vile, dishonorable, corrupt, iniquitous, depraved, reprobate, villainous, nefarious, vicious, malicious;
evil thrives in the ignorant - evil doers
Taburkett, I don't feel that any one of those aspects of your "evil" definition apply to me. Can you perhaps allow that I am not "evil?"
As a Christian, I am evil, as are all of mankind. When we compare ourselves to the "perfect" with all our imperfections, we are as dirty rags, to be burned.
Our saving can only be accomplished by believing in the "perfect". Jesus Christ.
Thankyou. You have just crystalized for me in a few words everything thats is wrong with the christian religion.
jonnycomelately - no one has said you were evil. you chose to depict yourself based on your interpretation of words conveying the truth. I do not judge anyone. I simply allow them to depict themselves. This is true even when I assist troubled youth
taburkett: What you refuse to admit (or recognize) is that you want to impose your version of morality on others, based on your beliefs. This is known as religious authoritarianism.
The only truth you know about, Taburkett, is the truth about your self....and you are avoiding that! Get real, man!
WOW - Winston Smith 84 - you seem to believe that I am society. But, I am just a follower of the morals that society declares correct. While others wish to declare immoral as moral, I choose to follow societies prescribed moral path. Moral truth wins
taburkett, on the contrary, it is you who seem to think that you speak for society, in that you pontificate as to what society deems proper. When in reality, you project the moral imperatives of your belief system. Society comprises all.
Lighting candles does not please God; only repentance from sin and faith in Jesus Christ as Savior and Lord will get you to heaven.
Ok, Sir, Friend... interesting comment, thank you. Looking at 5 words you have used, when applied to human ethics is negative: lust, greed, arrogance, guilt, ignorance. Yet in terms of animal survival instincts can have a positive origin.
Humans are the most elevated beings on this planet because of their sense of ethics and morals. It is the human beings that have been given the divine consciousness and they should always rise above survival instincts.
The serenity expressed through acceptance of oneself leads to a deeper love for God's children. As brothers and sisters in a moral society the individual discovers a path to a serene peaceful place. Through advancement of knowledge wisdom is found
I would agree up to a point, but if we cannot see and understand what those instincts are, and how they manifest, then we will not be able to rise above them... Greed, etc., needs to be recognized for what it is. IMHO
When something is only evaluated up to a point, truth is never achieved.
"We are what we repeatedly do. Excellence, then, is not an act, but a habit."
"The worst form of inequality is to try to make unequal things equal."
So, taburkett, you asked the question, "Why are people afraid...?" Have you found your answer yet? Is the answer in your own writings? Also, are you afraid to tell us who you are?
Anyone who refuses to have a two-way discussion and instead just keeps reverting to their own agenda is peculiar and irritating. People are frightened of this like they are of a salesman, defensive and on guard against being taken advantage of.
I walk the way of good people and keep to the path of the righteous.
I lead by example and I present truth always.
The walk is very easy when one follows the true path of righteousness.
Truth is always simple to describe because it never winds a lie.
Hi Jonnycomelately, I think humans have to first understand themselves before they concern themselves with other species.
Hi Taburkett, what is good to some is not so good for others, I would just keep that in mind.
Nothing is perfect, but those that follow Jesus Christ are saved.
James 5:16 For this reason, confess your sins to each other and pray for each other so that you may be healed. The prayer of the righteous person is powerful in what it can achieve.
Saved from what, taburkett? Precisely, please, no beating about the bush.
@Muhammad Meah True nobody is perfect
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To which group of "Christians" do you refer? I know of no true Christians who wish to kill (that is, murder) people they don't like.
If we blame God for the work of the devil, then we must take action as a loyal individual to defeat the devil that has placed those misled individuals into our presence.
glynch1, when ever you use the term "true christian," and deride people for not being such, you are obviously proclaiming yourself as a "true christian." Arrogant.
jonny-you obviously demand perfection from others, yet attack without provocation. Christians live a righteous life filled with peace through honor, Integrity, and faith. The devil is ever expanding his following. This will destroy the moral society.
Taburkett, you would do well on the stage as a comedian.
I don't see glynch deriding anybody in this comment.. However, your comment is excellent. What gets me irked are the ones who criticize others for doing something then they turn around and do the same thing.
You are correct. It is not the religion but evil people that create the fear. Love of thy neighbor is what is taught. But greed and despair cripple the masses who deny this. Jesus Christ provides the way for Christians.
Matthew 6:1 "Be careful not to do your 'acts of righteousness' before men, to be seen by them. If you do, you will have no reward from your Father in heaven."
1Timothy4-15 Be diligent about this work, throw yourself into it, so that your progress may be clear to everyone. 16 Pay attention to yourself and to the teaching, continue in it, for by so doing you will deliver both yourself and those who hear you.
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Or, the premise itself is based upon insufficient evidence. Look at the suffering in your world. Your higher being controls that? Then it is not worthy of your worship.
Most suffering is caused by "man." God has given us a perfect Earth and look what we have done to it.
JimMiles-Are you familiar with "Free Will"? And "Freedom of Choice"? It's pickin' the Holy way or that of the devil. Pretty certain you understand.
Hey, Happy, which holy way to choose? Do you think any old holy way is OK, or do you have only one "right way" in mind? 38,000 Christian denominations, many of which claim to be the only true way. Didn't Jesus pray for unity? Hate it when God ignores
God still only sees one church, regardless of what man sees and does. God's way is still the right way. That's what's amazing about mankind, we can mess up everything, and still think we're right. Ignorance is bliss!
jstfishinman: God sees one church. So He won't care if I join either the Catholics or the Protestants, the Westboro Baptists, the Branch Davidians, the Mormons, the JWs, SDAs, Christian Scientists, or Scientologists? R U Unitarian Universalist?
JimMiles Right, brother. I stand by my comment. I don't essentially see myself at odds with your thrust.
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